Converation thread

You're so stupid it's beyond belief. You think you can perfect human nature under your little socialist utopia, where everyone holds hands and sings kumbaya in a beautiful circle of life. Well, maybe ignorance it bliss. Maybe I shouldn't hammer some hell into your head, and let you live on in dreamland, but if you believe this crap please don't vote. Dream on!

What "human nature" is there to "perfect"..? That claim doesn't even make sense. Humans are adaptively conditioned under whatever system they materially exist within; there is no objective or intrinsic "human nature" to frame society around, so I have no idea what it is you think any society is "perfecting"?

Secondly, I didn't even advocate for a "utopia", since it's an entirely subjective concept that doesn't exist. I merely advocated for a system that is owned and operated BY the public itself, instead of by private interests. You're free to dispute that, but given the fact that you seemed to be unable to, and instead had to attack a strawman, with some ad hominem mixed in, suggests that you couldn't...

If you don't understand the very basic concept of human nature then this argument is hopeless. You're no longer illogical, you alogical, and will undermine every genuine argument. Also, the straw man fallacy that you allege that I made is completely false, because I define socialism as virtually every single person on the face of this planet does -- government ownership of private property. If you define it some other way, I would be happy to listen to your idea is. But it's so ironic that you accuse me of being illogical when you don't even appear to know what the philoso…  Read morephy that you claim to subscribe to is. I figured no one would be stupid enough for me to have to debate the meaning of socialism, rather than the fact of socialism, but your impertinence and idioticy knows no bounds. So please define, clearly, your idea of socialism for me or this argument is impossible.

I didn't realize that you were unironically under the impression that socialism is "when the government owns everything", because that's literally a meme. Socialism has never meant that, nor has any socialist economist or thinker ever claimed that, so I'm not sure where you even made that assertion from..? Socialism isn't even a governmental system, it is an economic one, so your false definition doesn't even make sense either.

Socialism is, in it's most basic definition, an economic system in which the means of production are socially-owned (hence the…  Read more name). Socialism is definitionally characterized on the basis that all workers/citizens would share democratic ownership over the products/profits of their own labor, without any private owners.

Capitalism believes government should leave us alone, socialism believes it should run our lives. Simple as that

lol this is blatantly false, considering that there are a plethora of pro-state capitalist ideologies, just as there are a plethora of anti-state socialist ideologies. Each system has nearly endless forms, encompassing a wide range of ideologies within "capitalism" and "socialism".

The ideology that YOU seem to believe in is likely some form of Libertarian-Capitalism, or perhaps even Minarcho-Capitalism, although not quite into the Anarcho-Capitalism range (since, if I recall correctly, you do still believe in the existence of a state but limited to military, right?). I can tell you don't have as much in-depth understanding of the deeper socio-economic ideologies contained within these systems, so perhaps look into the ones I named, as they might more accurately suit your actual beliefs..?

I looked into the ones you named and I'm a socially conservative Libertarian Capitalist, right-wing. You are a senseless authoritarian Socialist, environmentalist hippy, social justice warrior, left-wing.

I figured you were a Libertarian-Capitalist, yea, which is fundamentally right-wing, so that part was redundant to add on.

However, you still clearly don't understand the deeper ideologies, considering your wild yet vague assumption of me. I am an Anarcho-Communist, because I believe in a moneyless, stateless, classless form of socialism (aka communism) that is free of structural hierarchy (anarchism), hence Anarcho-Communism.

lol who said the government should be "extremely powerful"..? Do you just enjoy making up strawman arguments? Is it just easier to attack those if you make them up and ignore what the other person actually says?

Secondly, are you even talking about "the government" or " the state"? Because those are not inherently interchangeable. A "government" is simply any decision-making body for a society of people, which can be democratic, autocratic, etc. And again: I am arguing that the government should be made up of the entire public, not just a handful of leaders or politicians, aka non-hierarchical.

Since you admit to still believing in a government, I'm curious to know how you think society's decisions should be made..?